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Subaru B4 Turbo blown :( Please help


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#1 Doddyz

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Posted 17 December 2017 - 10:53 PM

HI guys My Subaru 2001 liberty b4 has been throwing a engine check light and been driving like a normally aspirated car until 5000rpm when I get some slight boost.

 

Found out my turbo on the drivers side which I assume is the VF32 Secondary turbo? PLease correct me if im wrong. Is cactus!

 

I suspect the metal filter in the banjo bolt oil feed for the turbo has blocked up. Causing a lack of lubrication to my turbo. My turbo makes a metallic noise which I suspect is  the shaft bearing has let go.

 

What I dont understand is I thought the drivers side turbo is the secondary turbo. Meaning to create boost up the higher rpm range.

I have slight boost at 5 or 6000 rpm but no boost down low.  I know my  drivers side turbo is no good.

 

Can someone please explain why if this is the secondary turbo for boost up high, why am i getting boost up high and not down low  example 2 to 4 grand.

 

Can someone please also verify  what the drivers side turbo is? Is it a VF32? and is it the Secondary turbo?

 

Also im a bit confused as I have hear one of the twin turbos is ball bearing and one isnt?

 

Anyone got a 2nd hand one as Im after one in the WTB section.

 

Also how hard is the driverside turbo to take out? I hope its not engine out time...

 

Anyhelp much appreciated.

 

 

 

 



#2 zanzarah

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 12:42 AM

Passenger side turbo is VF33(primary) sleeve bearing and rebuildable (or good secondhand one).
Drivers side turbo is VF32(secondary) ball bearing. Rebuild bearing sets are available but a new turbo replacement would be more cost effective if available, or good secondhand one even better.
The VF33 runs initial or single turbo boost up to approximately 4100-4200 rpm then transition with boost dip to combine with the VF32 for twin turbo boost from approx 4800-5000 rpm.The car will remain in twin turbo mode as long as the engine rpm is above 3300rpm.Once below that it will switch back to single/primary turbo only mode.
The turbos can be changed out without removing the engine.
From what you have written it is the VF33 turbo that needs to be rebuilt or replaced.

Liberty B4 2002 BE5 Rev E 2.5L BITURBO TF035HL-14GXT E85


#3 KONG

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 04:08 AM

How do you know the driver side turbo is no good?

What is the CEL code?



#4 Doddyz

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 04:14 AM

I know because code 1241 came up also you can here the shaft or turbine metal to metal sound when reving the car and at idle. Its the turbo trust me. Not the heatshield or linkages as these where checked. Drivers side turbo is noisy.

 

I thought the drivers side is for higher rpm  but it dosent make sense. Drivers side turbo defiantly needs replacing as is noisy. Primary makes no noise. HOwever no boost down low rpm



#5 KONG

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 05:36 AM

So the driver side turbo is noisy at idle? The problem with that is, there's supposed to be no exhaust gas supply to that turbo at idle. The exhaust control valve should be in the closed position.

   

You are correct in thinking that turbo is for higher RPM boost.

 

 

It could very well be that the secondary is blown like you suspect.

What I'm thinking is ..... your exhaust control valve possibly hasn't been sealing at idle & when the the car is below 4K rpm (for whatever reason) Which would mean the secondary is constantly spooling and has worn out as a result.  

 

This could also explain why you are getting a 1241 CEL.  

Perhaps the air fuel ratios are out of whack because of the abnormal secondary operation, SPV feeding the secondary boost back in to the intake when the ECU is not expecting it etc.

 

It could also explain the lack of primary boost as there isn't ample exhaust pressure to spool the primary.

 

My only other experience with that code was in this thread http://www.subyclub....-b4-code-p1241/

 

The ECV was part of the problem there, along with intake and boost leaks.

 

A broken, loose or incorrectly adjusted ECV flap makes a horrible noise that could easily be interpreted as "Turbo noise".  It's in the general area of the secondary and the rattle & vibration would definitely echo through the up pipe to the turbo.

 

Best scenario is.... the ECV is not working and throwing the TT system out of whack.

 

Worst scenario is.... both turbos & the ECV are forked



#6 Doddyz

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Posted 23 December 2017 - 09:50 AM

Hi how hard is it to remove the secondary turbo? I only have jack stands and a jack at home.

Can you get to most of the bolts from the top of the engine except the exhaust?

 

You mentioned that secondary turbo shouldnt be operating or spinning at all at idle.

So should the ecv valve be fully closed at idle?

 

Any tricky bolts that are hard to get too. All the oil and coolant lines look easy to remove.

 

How long roughly should it take to remove it? I assume you take the intercooler out..Any thing else needs to be removed?

Can i just unbolt the turbo at the dump pipe without undoing the whole or both exhausts?

 

Can the turbo be lifted out from the top?

 

Could it possibly have a carbon built up so the ecv cant close?

 

Can i manually somehow close this ecv to see if i get boost down lower rpm like 2 to 3 k like it should?

 

Is the ecv is open at idle and its meant to be closed that could explain why im not getting boost till 5 or 6k

 

Is there anything else I should check regarding the ecv .

 

Also how do i clean the bbod and solenoids etc

 

I have a replacement turbo

 

Many thanks



#7 duncanm

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Posted 23 December 2017 - 11:12 AM

turbos are easy (but fiddly) to remove in the driveway.

 

You'll need to get underneath to access some of the heat shield bolts and probably the lower turbo/dump bolts.

 

turbo heat shields off (this is fiddly) first, then couple of brackets bolt the dumps to the gbox and they have a rear donut-style flex joint to the rest of the exhaust after the 2:1, turbo-dump bolts obviously, then turbos off.

 

Definitely need to remove TMIC, turbo to TMIC pipes plus anything else in the way.

 

I'd suggest dropping the dumps and inspecting (wiggle) the turbine shafts before proceeding.



#8 zanzarah

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Posted 23 December 2017 - 02:22 PM

The ECV may just need adjusting. Check that first.Yes ECV should be closed at idle. It will rattle if slightly open at idle.

Liberty B4 2002 BE5 Rev E 2.5L BITURBO TF035HL-14GXT E85


#9 Doddyz

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Posted 23 December 2017 - 03:45 PM

How do you adjust the ecv linkage so the butterfly is closed at idle?



#10 zanzarah

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Posted 23 December 2017 - 05:38 PM

The ECV is a swing valve.

The Large actuator on the drivers side controls it.

The rod leading out from it underneath has a long central adjustment nut with shorter locking nuts top and bottom.

Releasing  the locking nuts will a low you to rotate the long adjustment nut.These nuts have opposite thread to each other 

Clockwise to tighten and anti to loosen.

If your valve is not worn or damaged the standard adjustment is:

Loosen valve until it chatters with the engine running at idle.

Then tighten two full turns and then lock it in position 


Liberty B4 2002 BE5 Rev E 2.5L BITURBO TF035HL-14GXT E85


#11 LukeFranky

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Posted 05 January 2018 - 05:29 PM

I had the same problem when I first bought my B4. Primary turbo was seized from oil leaking on to the exhaust side of the turbo and turning to carbon.

 

An always open ECV is a possibility as others have mentioned.


The B4 Bomber - 2002 MY03 Subaru Liberty B4, ADM, Manual, EJ208. 


#12 Beckers

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Posted 06 January 2018 - 12:32 PM

My ECV rattles at little bit between 2250 and 2500 rpm, 

I only notice it in 2nd gear, when going slow over speed humps etc.

 

Hey Kong, How much boost did you run on whitekong ?

I'm pretty sure you said 20psi on the secondary, but what about the primary ?



#13 KONG

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Posted 07 January 2018 - 11:50 AM

My ECV rattles at little bit between 2250 and 2500 rpm, 
I only notice it in 2nd gear, when going slow over speed humps etc.
 
Hey Kong, How much boost did you run on whitekong ?
I'm pretty sure you said 20psi on the secondary, but what about the primary ?


Originally 19/20psi (depending on its mood) but after all the dicking around it ended up at 17psi mate.

#14 Doddyz

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Posted 12 March 2018 - 05:49 AM

OK so I haven't posted for ages. But incase anyone was interested. My turbo ended up being fine however the ecv flap had in and out movement in it.

Causing the valve not to seal properly allowing exhaust gases to bypass my exhaust compressor wheel, hence not getting boost down low.

 

Simple fix was I installed a 2nd hand VF32 turbo and kept my old turbo which was fine except for the ecv that had movement.



#15 LukeFranky

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Posted 12 March 2018 - 06:49 AM

Did you install a new ECV with that VF32 too?


The B4 Bomber - 2002 MY03 Subaru Liberty B4, ADM, Manual, EJ208. 


#16 KONG

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Posted 12 March 2018 - 07:27 AM

Good news. Has changing the turbo and ECV fixed the CEL & boost also?

#17 libertyB4andafter

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Posted 15 March 2018 - 12:18 PM

I'm having the same problem currently.

I just changed the primary turbo for a brand new one but I'm still getting code: P1241

I noticed the new turbo waste gate line didn't have the 0.8mm restrictor pill in it so i took that off the old turbo and placed it in the correct spot.

The car now has adequate vacuum but doesn't seem to have any boost at all. I'm thinking the ECV may need adjusting? 



#18 KONG

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Posted 15 March 2018 - 02:21 PM

Firstly check your vac tank is holding vacuum. You can do this by pulling line 1 off the nipple on your BBOD or the line off the intercooler control valve on the aluminium secondary intercooler hard pipe.

If there's no vacuum being held then your icv won't be sealing the primary boost in the IC.

If it has vacuum then check every single vac line is going to the right spot.

Do you have an aftermarket BOV?

ECV adjustment is a last resort.

#19 libertyB4andafter

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Posted 15 March 2018 - 05:02 PM

No problem I will check the vac tank and report back. I'm thinking that because I removed the intercooler to replace the turbo maybe I knocked something I'll check the lines under the intercooler also.
Yes I have an aftermarket GFB BOV.
My boost gauge runs off the same vac line. I have also done the line 10 mod is it worth returning that back to factory?

#20 KONG

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Posted 16 March 2018 - 05:20 AM

Best to keep the line 10 mod. If you diconnected all 4 hoses when the intercooler was taken off there's a chance you accidently mixed up the lines when replacing them. Just make sure line 1 goes to icv. If you pull line 1 off at the ICV you should hear the hissing of air being sucked in to the hose and you should see the actuator rod on the icv move.




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