58 replies to this topic

[allpaw4]

The entire drive train is different between the RX and B4 - diff, gearbox, driveshafts, steering rack, suspension, the list goes on. The body shape, panels, and chassis are about the only things that are the same. Even the front lower control arms are different. Not to mention the upgrades to the front end by going to the Rev D/E.

In your case I would be selling the RX and getting a B4, and then changing the engine/gearbox/diff and probably brakes. Providing the struts are fairly new, you wont have to change them. Otherwise rebuild them (Cheap!). Nothing else will need to be done. That way you get the nice dash, momo steering wheel, etc.

There are so many pros to getting the B4 over using the RX. Been there done that. As a result, I have a 00 RX and an 02 B4. Guess which one is fiddled. Believe me when I say it is probably going to save you 10 to 15 thousand getting the turbo model to start with.

I know its your choice, but I really do recommend going the B4 route.

Cheers,
Ben

[Shaz]

The thing is Nick, once you turbo your car, its still going to be an RX.
And no, the end result wont be a B4. It will be a turbo RX

Like what others have said, buying the B4 to start with, will be a much better base to go on, but won't be as individualistic.

Why dont you look for a Gen 3 Manual Heritage Sedan, and save some cash, trade your car in + cash.

Then you have leather, sunroof, etc etc?

In my situation, the price difference between the $5k i paid for my Heritage wagon, and the $20k for a GT-B Wagon made my choice relativly simple.

Cheers,
Shazza

[Morgan]

Why dont you look for a Gen 3 Manual Heritage Sedan

Going to be looking for a while!

[AussieTemplar]

The entire drive train is different between the RX and B4 - diff, gearbox, driveshafts, steering rack, suspension, the list goes on. The body shape, panels, and chassis are about the only things that are the same. Even the front lower control arms are different. Not to mention the upgrades to the front end by going to the Rev D/E.

In your case I would be selling the RX and getting a B4, and then changing the engine/gearbox/diff and probably brakes. Providing the struts are fairly new, you wont have to change them. Otherwise rebuild them (Cheap!). Nothing else will need to be done. That way you get the nice dash, momo steering wheel, etc.

There are so many pros to getting the B4 over using the RX. Been there done that. As a result, I have a 00 RX and an 02 B4. Guess which one is fiddled. Believe me when I say it is probably going to save you 10 to 15 thousand getting the turbo model to start with.

I know its your choice, but I really do recommend going the B4 route.

Cheers,
Ben

The thing is Nick, once you turbo your car, its still going to be an RX.
And no, the end result wont be a B4. It will be a turbo RX

Like what others have said, buying the B4 to start with, will be a much better base to go on, but won't be as individualistic.

Why dont you look for a Gen 3 Manual Heritage Sedan, and save some cash, trade your car in + cash.

Then you have leather, sunroof, etc etc?

In my situation, the price difference between the $5k i paid for my Heritage wagon, and the $20k for a GT-B Wagon made my choice relativly simple.

Cheers,
Shazza

I guess this is all true. I really am just eager to get my hands dirty and experience "converting" an N/A engine to a turbo. My enthusiasm probably took a hold of common sense!

Thanks for the advice guys, I guess I got a few years to decide haha.

[Shaz]

Just buy a turbo motor that's broken. And fix that up.
Save some cash and buy a STi halfcut, and if you have room, store it at your place. You can spend a few years pulling it apart, cleaning everything, respraying parts, replace hoses, parts, etc etc.

Just buy a late model STi halfcut, and don't plan to buy a car newer then the halfcut.

It will basically fit into any Subaru with ease.

That way, you've got a project, while still being able to use your car. And then once you've finished your p's, buy a B4/OUTBACK/LIBERTY/LEGACY/BRUMBY/IMPREZA and then you have a brand new motor you've built, and if you decide not to put it your car, sell it, buy a shell, and start converting.

Win.

Cheers,
Shazza

[AussieTemplar]

Just buy a turbo motor that's broken. And fix that up.
Save some cash and buy a STi halfcut, and if you have room, store it at your place. You can spend a few years pulling it apart, cleaning everything, respraying parts, replace hoses, parts, etc etc.

Just buy a late model STi halfcut, and don't plan to buy a car newer then the halfcut.

It will basically fit into any Subaru with ease.

That way, you've got a project, while still being able to use your car. And then once you've finished your p's, buy a B4/OUTBACK/LIBERTY/LEGACY/BRUMBY/IMPREZA and then you have a brand new motor you've built, and if you decide not to put it your car, sell it, buy a shell, and start converting.

Win.

Cheers,
Shazza

Awesome. Where's the best place to buy a broken motor? Just to look around, get an idea etc

Thanks Shaz.

[Shaz]

Ichiban
Justjap
Importmonster
eBay
Subyclub
Nengun
Tradingpost
Carsales
Rexnet
Google

Cheers,
Shazza

[Jimbo]

Hmmm.. Well, think of it this way.

Ive done conversion and had factory turbo models.

If i could have done it all again, i wouldnt have spent a cent on my GX when i first got it and just saved and saved and bought something already done.

Yes, there comes satisfaction of doing the hard work yourself but theres ALOT involved in doing a conversion and depending what route you go for sometimes it just doesnt weigh up. When doing conversions, **** goes missing, things dont fit, things get overlooked or not looked at at all. Its so much effort. Plus theres the downside of having your car off the road for quite sometime, weeks, even months if things dont go right. With your Gen3, you will need a wiring loom modified ect. **** just doesnt just drop in your engine bay and work.

The other downside of a conversion is that when you sell it, its worth 3/5 of **** all. Back in the early 00's i paid $7500 for a bog stock 92' GX, spent about 3 times the original purchase price on it, had some fun broke 2 motors and 3 gearboxes and alot of other stuff. I sold it last year for $4000 and that was the most i could get for it.


If i were you, dont bother with being humble, smug and satisfied you built something up because as soon as the headaches start, all that goes out the window and you end up hating the car, trust me.

These days an MY05 Liberty GT can be had for $15k. Thats not a great deal of cash for soemthng that was worth about $50k + 5-6 years ago.

Same with the B4, can be had for peanuts. SAVE SAVE AND SAVE your money while your on your P's and i bet you will have even MORE satisfaction knowing you worked hard and saved your money and bought something that will probably go quicker than your conversion ever will. And since you paid for and own the beautiful car you just bought, mod away!

Food for thought. Ive been down this path plenty of times, listen to experienced peoples advice!

[Chadza]

My advice would be to listen to the advice of guys that have been there done that! Pretty much all of them are saying "I would never do that again". Sure you need to do something before you can learn from it, but when a 'mistake' will be this expensive and at this stage of your life when money is very precious, take the advice, buy a B4 and then when you are 35 years old and earning 100K plus a year then have your fun with tinkering.

I was nearly going to convert a previous car (nissan) from N/A to turbo and when I REALLY thought about all the little things that would need to be done in my garage I just KNEW that I would get a point (such as wiring up the new engine) that I wouldnt be able to do and THEN WHAT? You would have to get the car towed to a workshop, get the workshop to fix up your mess and then tow the car home, unless you had finished the rest of the car enough to make it run. Then there are registration issues. Your car would be registered as an RX, so to turn it into a 'B4' I would say you'd need to get it either engineered or at least taken through the pits to be able to re-register it. It all equals BIG $$$$$$$$$$$

It sounds grand to be able to convert a car into the car of your dreams, and I think we all admire you for it, but this is REALLY one of those times to just buy something already done. By the time you are able to drive a turbo car, B4's will be in the $12-15K range.

[FR34KO]

Dont have much time to write this, or read every comment, but heres my quick thoughts, albeit muddled up hahaa

I had the same thoughts as you previously Nick, im nie on 2 months to get my blacks now (whoa, shocked myself how close it is haha).
But after thinking, im planning on buying a stock Foz 25XT, '08 in 1-3 or so years so im doing absolutley no engine/performance mods to my lib to save money (besides lowering front springs).
I may change my mind -I might buy an N/a Foz and turbo that, or stick to modding the turbo version.. i dont know, but right now its not a large matter

In the end im sure (personally) it will be the better choice.. Ill say goodbye to my Berty to some youngin who may thrash it, but ill be happy with the foz cos its more practical and suited to my needs, which overall, is better in the long run, so why waste money on what i have now. also, Some things that i bought for my Lib, ill just bring over to my Forester -saving again


if you choose to mod this car; personally, i think Converting an Auto trans to a Manual is a complete waste of money, time, effort -whats the point? Manual's are common, take off your rsk bumper and rims, etc, and buy a manual, possibly for less than u sell your current ride..


anyhoo, just take time and fight the modding bug (ive got it!) and goodluck in your decision

[Jimbo]

Conversion Pros:

- Retaining your beloved' car
- Satisfaction of your own work
- Cheaper insurance than a factory turbo model
- Learning ins and outs of your car and how stuff works
- Mechanical aptitude

Conversion Cons:

- Sourcing a suitable engine
- Risking buying a cut with a dodgy motor
- Warranty options with cut provider
- Transportation of cut
- Paying for wiring modifications
- Age of compatible gear
- Replacing clutch, timing belt ect
- Extended times off the road
- RTA paperwork requirements
- Car wont have a strong re-sell
- Car can be difficult to sell
- Things will get broken, wont fit and get misplaced in conversion duration
- Suitable environment to perform work
- Will need an engine crane
- Nothing ever goes back the same it was (dash,trim ect)
- Eventually you will hate your car

[Scuba-Roo]

Conversions are like having a cake, you can go to woolies and buy everything you need, then mix it all up and wait an hour or so for it to bake, then have a big mess to clean up, then you have a cake, no iceing, no cream or jam, or you can buy one from woolies for $5 thats already done ready to eat and taste nicer.

Untill you actually do major work on your car you don't realise how much of a Bi7ch it can be.


If your really keen on engines and building and learning etc buy yourself a gen1 GX or a gen1 RS/gx conversion. you can buy a turbo gen1 for under 5k now, and i'd be surprised if you couldnt get a decent gen1GX NA with a broken headgasket or something for much more then 1k. Muck around with that. take it to track days and and local motorsport events. you'll learn heaps. it'l be your own build car, and it will cost a fuckload less

[alexGT]

i've got an ej25 turbo block that you can build up.

[DukeNik'em]

http://www.raptorsc..../kits.php?id=20


DO IT!!!!!!!!


No joke this was the company I was going to use to SC my SV6, they're one of the best local manufacturers. Cheaper than conversion. DO IT!!!!!!!

[allpaw4]

To put forced induction on an N/A EJ series suby motor is a waste of money and will be extremely expensive when the engine blows. Supercharging has been discussed many times and has been shot down every time.

For the outlay in coin, turbo wins out every time by large amounts.

Please do a search and look at the info in those threads rather than contaminate an extremely good thread like this one.
I don't mean to come across rude or obnoxious, I'm simply stating it how it is. Please don't take it personally!

Cheers,
Ben

[Matt]

Personally I wouldn't buy a B4, but thats purely down to personal opinion. There is just far too many reported failures for my liking. Not just little things giving up but complete terminal engine failure.

Pretty much the only reason i converted mine!! Twin Turbo aidz!!!!

I wanted a B4 (without leather) but with 6-speed,brembos,R180,sti engine....so i wouldve done all that
in the long run, and honestly cost me more.

Pretty much the only benifit i would have gotten would have been the leather, (yuuck!!) blackout dash,
(got one cheap ) alloy control arms ($200) and a scooped bonnet (finding one is a fricken nightmare
for a rev D/E)

Im probably missing a few things here (mustn't be important)

Mind you i didnt do too much myself, thanks Al (im a electrician,not a mechanic)
but i now have a car i am totally stoked on....and i do not intend to sell my car, at all.

Just my opinion though, ive still never actually driven or been in a B4 lol

[AussieTemplar]

Thanks for all the advice guys, this thread is gold. It's all food for thought. I guess at the moment I think it's best I just relax and wait until I am off my P's or atleast out of school with a nice stable full time income.. then decide which route to take. Both sides have their pros and cons and I guess the more sensible side would be to just buy a factory turbo car, rather than build one my self.

Thanks again y'all and anymore adivce would be highly welcomed and appreciated!

Nick

[Jimbo]

Glad you took it on board. When your in a financial situation where you can afford to make a decision, just go for something second hand if it ticks all the boxes. Conversions just arent worth the headache when its your only car.

Dont forget too, later on down the track when your older and have a stable income, you can always do a conversion in the backyard as a project. In doing that, your not under pressure to get it back on the road asap cos its your daily and you can take time with the process and do it right from the start.

[AussieTemplar]

Glad you took it on board. When your in a financial situation where you can afford to make a decision, just go for something second hand if it ticks all the boxes. Conversions just arent worth the headache when its your only car.

Dont forget too, later on down the track when your older and have a stable income, you can always do a conversion in the backyard as a project. In doing that, your not under pressure to get it back on the road asap cos its your daily and you can take time with the process and do it right from the start.

I'm probably still a few years away and dreaming, but I hope to have my own nice big garage to have projet cars It's probably a fantasy as affording anything like that in the area I live at the moment is not possible unless you on a 6 figure sum a year.

I'd use my dad's garage but thats full of all his **** for work.