41 replies to this topic

[El_Freddo]

Compression test will happen this weekend Jase, I find after work hours to hectic to get outside to tinker and by the time I can it’s too late to be making noise as I’m working under a lean to…

If I rev the engine it becomes smooth. I can’t put a load on it since this is all dummied up in a halfcut. If I disconnect the coil pack on the offending cylinder and rev the engine it behaves exactly the same - smooths out and doesn’t sound like there’s a misfire until coming back down to idle again.

I’ll do this compression test then most likely move on to fitting all the other bits such as final airbox configuration, thermo fans (arrived in the mail this week - two 11 inch SPAL fans), sorting out the gearbox crossmember and the shifter linkages.

Still lots of other things to be done, I’d just like to have the engine running sweet before the big swap happens, but on a long motor with a known dead HG this might not be possible…

I’ll keep that gearbox oil in mind too Barbs and Duncan! How do the NA ratios feel behind the turbo Duncan?

Cheers

Bennie

[El_Freddo]

Compression test done on a cold engine:

Cyl 1 = 185psi
Cyl 2 = 200psi
Cyl 3 = 210psi
Cyl 4 = 205psi

No1 cylinder is down on compression but I didn’t think it would be enough to be an issue that I’m seeing.

From the figures I can find online this is way above what the factory turbos seem to pull which makes sense being NA but those figures are also much higher than I expected.

Also, being that cylinder 1 is down on compression this to me indicates it’s the one suffering from the blown head gasket, but with a pressure rating that high I’d think the cylinder would still be effective and not induce the shaking I’m seeing at idle.

This leads me back to the issue being the injector. Next I’ll swap these around as much as I’m not looking forward to it…

That’s all for now.

Cheers

Bennie

[Barbbachello]

Compression looks fine

Something of note is that at least phase 1 engines would cut timing on cylinder 1 if the ECU thought it couldnt control the idle speed. Im assuming youve got some bastardised loom and setup going on here with a check engine light on the ecu. Might be cutting timing to control idle

[El_Freddo]

That’s interesting Barbs.

What I don’t have hooked up at the moment are:
- temp sensor in the up pipe for the original cat that’s no longer there in mine
- neutral switch or telling the ECU that it’s a manual by grounding a particular pin

The knock sensor could be wrong if they’re different between NA and Turbo. The turbo knock sensor is still on the turbo block.

Other than that I can’t work out what the code is with the CEL - I’ve got one the whole time the engine is running. I can’t seem to pull codes with the green plugs. I can’t recall having any black plugs. And I can’t use a scan tool if I had one as I need to reinstate my diagnostics plug as I stupidly cut that out.

The other things I don’t have hooked up are fuel level, demister and any of those random wires to odd areas of the vehicle.

I’ll endeavour to swap injectors to rule those out.

I’m in half a mind to lay over the WRX loom of the same era and try running it with its matching ECU, immobiliser and key. Only thing I haven’t confirmed is whether the plugs at the intake are pined the same. I know the WRX ECU is pinned slightly different to the GT foz.

Cheers

Bennie

[Barbbachello]

Neutral switch will usually cause idle issues

Knock sensor should be the same between NA and turbo afaik

[El_Freddo]

Ok! Got this one LICKED and Im stoked!!

Such a simple issue - had the wires on my cam angle sensor extension the wrong way around between the plug and the sensor. AS the story goes, after leaving plugs out from the compression test I swapped the injectors on the RHS bank, put plugs back in, failed to connect the coils on the LHS bank and fired it up with the same shakey-shakey engine running when I realised my mistake. This lead me to discover that cylinder four apparently wasnt doing anything either which meant that if cylinder 2 or 3 was disconnected the engine was apparently running on 1 cylinder which I thought wasnt possible - but it is and Ive got a video showing it.

So I was a bit baffled at this point but knew the two cylinders that werent doing anything must be batch fired/squirted or connected in some way. This got me thinking my trigger wheel on the crank was slightly different to the NA one that I think Im using and I couldnt find the one from the GT engine but I know its around somewhere and labelled if not on this engine. I then thought about the cam angle sensor and came up with the idea that two cylinders could be fired off the crank with a TDC reference. So I tested out running the engine and pulling the cam angle sensor wiring while it was running. Surprise surprise, nothing changed. After shutting the engine off I examined the cam angle sensor plug shape and its mount on the cam angle sensor itself then looked at my wiring extension. It was clear to me the wiring was parallel to the orientation of the plug and cam sensor as they freely sat, but this wasnt the orientation of how the plug mated to the cam sensor.

Bingo! Sorted that out and the last couple of months worth of stuffing around came to fruition and was not what I thought it was, this wasnt even on my radar!

Next is to start the fitment of the engine bay and finally wrap all the wiring - this has its own hurdle with a grommet I want to use being backwards. Other hurdles:
- fitting the airbox into an engine bay that seems to be missing ~30mm of space on one side (guessing engine bay is 60mm narrower than the EJ platform
- fitting the thermo fans with the stock brumby radiator - not so much a hurdle
- fit the PS pump and the turbo oil feed line where the oil feed currently passes straight through the PS pumps real estate
- work out where the remote PS res tank will live
- still got the turbo and master cylinder interference issue. A VF turbo will sort this out, or an EJ master cylinder swap.
- gearbox and diff ratio. Will have to play with this one in due time I think
- gearbox crossmember for the EJ AWD gearbox
- shortening the gear shifter linkages - going to cut 100mm out and see how that goes.
- and the final thing to work out once its all in Redback brumby is the tailshaft. Ive heard of a trick using a torana or kingswood tailshaft with the brumby ends/yokes on it. Guess Ill work that one out too as I have both of these tailshafts.

For the engine I want to get the heads fully serviced, this will come down to coin as to when this happens. Id love to throw a front LSD into the gearbox too, Ill wait until I know what box Ill stick with before moving forward on this one.

Happy days, not a dead injector!

I guess a last question is: if you had a choice between running a WRX bugeye (GD I think) ECU etc or the GT forester setup, which would you use and why? Asking as I believe the WRX ECU has a different tune on it for a tad bit more power than the GT tune. I realise cams come into this but theyre not part of the equation.

Cheers

Bennie

[Barbbachello]

Sounds like a head fork haha.

ECU wise is going to be much of a muchness

Both are tunable and you really should get a tune for this strange setup
 

[El_Freddo]

Hey Barbs I’ve read conflicting posts about the GT ECU being tuneable, mine is the series 2 with the phase 2 engine. I’m yet to confirm what the series 1 runs as I think it’s a phase 1 engine and this is possibly the engine management I’ve read about that’s apparently not tuneable.

I’ll cross the tuning bridge when I get there. Being that I should go this route, what VF turbo would you recommend with factory injectors and intercooler? I’m not going for all our power, just some boosted fun that should get me moving nicely.

I’m hoping to get some time on the project this week and plan out where bits are going. The EA81 engine bay has the battery on the opposite side of the engine bay to the L series and EJ platforms and I’d like to keep mine in the same spot. In this space I need to add the airbox and remote PS reservoir. That’ll keep me busy for a while.

I’ve got hold of a bugeye WRX gearbox that could be the one to use in this conversion. Two issues - it feels wrong to drop the low range from the brumby and the pull clutch won’t work in my conversion so I need to look into how to get around this since I don’t have a phase 2 single range NA box to swap cases with. That would be the easiest way to do it I reckon. Dropping a factory dual range EJ box would be easier again. But going by the revs/ratios in the Gen3 RX Liberty it seems to me that these ratios wouldn’t be suitable as you can be in 4th putting around at 50km/h and same for 5th at 60km/h. Cruising at 100km/h it revs just under 3000rpm. I could change 5th ratio easily enough for cruising but the shorter ratios don’t seem ideal.

Cheers

Bennie

[Barbbachello]

Yeah your engine has the same GD style manifold im using, assuming you havent changed it that means tunable ecu

Yes i believe the earlier ones with the 5/6 GC8 manifold are untunable without some hardware mods

You could run an earlier style power steering pump with the res on top from a GC8 WRX. Works just fine


Personally im all for the shorter ratios. Is it an 01 or 02 bugeye box? The first bugeye boxes we got are 3.54 and will be plenty long. 02+ will be 4.44 

Turbo engines with low compression need the revs to get going as im sure youre aware.

Any VF turbo will work just fine with factory injectors and cooler. Theyre pretty much all the same just with different size turbine housings or slightly different wastegate designs or compressor outlets. A VF48 is probably gonna be the easiest to get your hands on as they came on pretty much all STis for the last 15 years

[El_Freddo]

Thanks Barbs, yes, same intake manifold:



^ thats the 02 GT foz setup on the SOHC block. It looks a bit more crowded now with the factory air box dummied up and a temporary radiator rigged up for test running.

The WRX gearbox is from a 2000 bug eye. I took the rear diff too so I know Ive got the correct rear ratio if I go with this setup at some stage.

Not much has happened since the silly season. Now the mozzies are in force too.

Im still stoked as that it runs so well - it takes what seems like less than a second to fire up every time.

I do have a check engine light but thats not a huge issue at the moment and I still need to wire and ground the pin to tell the ECU its a manual, rewrite in the diagnostic plug (stupid move) and finalise some last wires that I think I dont need.

Itll get there, always slowly over here!

Also looking at turbos online, many of the VF48s have a different compressor housing with an outlet connector that is a bolt up flange arrangement of the later models. I also remembered that Ive got what I think is a VF8 that came with the engine Ive got lined up for the RS. That might be a bit small for what Im wanting but it would also be a good starting point to get the engine into the Brumby to get some real world testing done.

Ill have to look into that GC8 PS pump. Im guessing its different to the NA PS pump of the same era.

Lastly, gear selector linkages are in the process of being shortened to fit what I need. Thats another learning curve in itself!

Cheers

Bennie

[El_Freddo]

Cant remember exactly what engine you have Bennie but if its got the GD style 2 piece intake manifold with top feed injectors itll be a piece of piss to read that ECU

^ from here: http://www.subyclub....e-9#entry624452

Gday Barbs, reading the ECU shouldnt be a problem. Clearing codes, especially any historic ones is the issue I reckon. And yes, its the same manifold as the GD with the tumbler valves etc.

My diagnostics plug is required in and everything seems to communicate as it should, I just need to swap the power wires as its connected to permanent power instead of ignition power, one step half forward

How long can an old stored code survive in an ECU thats disconnected from power etc? Ive not touched the project in a while, partly hoping any old stored codes take a hike and never come back

I finally turned the grommet I wanted to retain around to the orientation that will fit the brumby perfectly, and added all the required wiring through at the same time:



^ I knew the dead clutch pressure plate from Basil the RX Gen3 would come in handy! Worked a treat and made this job a.) cheap and b.) piss easy.

Thats about where it sits for now. Usual stuff in the way - work (going good with a change of scenery) and family. Soon zero daylight and cold nights will kick in too ;(

Also need to work out a resistor trick to cancel out the need for the exhaust temp sensor in the catted up pipe that doesnt fit in this setup. Ive read about a 1/4watt 2.2k ohm resistor does the trick but the author of that tidbit of information wasnt certain about the wattage required anyone got some insight on that Ill be all ears!

On the TD turbo hitting the brake MCs bleed nipple, Ive got a VF8 that will solve this issue and its apparently slightly smaller than the VF12 from what Ive read. I thought the VF10 was between the VF8 and VF12 but apparently the VF10 is the smallest out of those three units. Go figure. Anyway Ive got a VF8 to use so Ive put that issue down as solved.

The other big hurdle to address now is laying out of the wiring loom under the dashboard - namely due to the bundle of wiring I cant shorten due to all the shielded wiring involved. I really need a dummy AC evaporator box to fit to the halfcut to get the most accurate picture of what goes where and what will interfere with what etc. Not a fun bit here.

Also 100mm taken out of the gear levers is good but too much on one shaft. Didnt really think that through. Had a thought that the Liberty gear selectors might be different to the impreza/foz unit so thats on my pick a part list to size up for potential differences. If its shorter Ill grab one as it could save me stuffing around trying to get it right when theres a factory option waiting to be used.

Thats it for now.

Cheers

Bennie

[Barbbachello]

Shifters are all the same length until Gen 4/GR era so unfortunately wont fix your issues. 

Personally id either bash that up pipe cat out or replace it with a non catted one. They are notorious for failing and destroying turbos. They were only in Foresters and WRXs for like 1 year before subaru realised it was a shit idea. Also worth while deleting the TGVs, 

Disconnecting the battery should clear stored codes but if its still an issue theyll come straight back

[El_Freddo]

Thanks for the info on the shift linkages, I’ll go back to modifying the way I was intending in the first place…

The catted up pipe is already gone - it doesn’t fit around the SOHC head, at least from memory it doesn’t fit!

Well I know what I’ll be slipping outside to do this Easter weened - hook it all up to fire up again to test this CEL situation. It was last connected to power about a month ago so that should be a decent battery dance to clear anything that’s on it. I’m not holding my breath though.

Cheers

Bennie

[duncanm]

Shifters are all the same length until Gen 4/GR era so unfortunately wont fix your issues. 

Not sure about that - outbag/liberty shifters certainly have a different bend &/or length, due to the body lift.

[Barbbachello]

Interesting. Dont recall shifter linkage being on the list of bits to change for a delift. I could be wrong though

[allpaw4]

Not sure on the manuals, but they are definitely different in the autos.

[duncanm]

Interesting. Dont recall shifter linkage being on the list of bits to change for a delift. I could be wrong though

 

Sorry - not linkage - shifter.

[Beckers]

Interesting. Dont recall shifter linkage being on the list of bits to change for a delift. I could be wrong though

I used the same  manual shifter when I delifted my outback

[El_Freddo]

Still got the CEL illuminated with the engine running ;(

I’ll work on that later. Can’t be too hard to sort out down the track. Only things I can think of are:
- neutral switch not connected
- VSS not connected yet - but that’s never been an issue with other loom cut downs - there’s a first for everything though
- temp sensor thingy in the uppipe is connected in the old uppipe, with a straight through unit fitted. I’m wondering if this uppipe needs to be grounded rather than just sitting somewhere.

I’ve decided to cut the section of loom out that I don’t need due to the length being so long. It shouldn’t be too hard to do if I take my time and concentrate. And I reckon it’ll look mint once it’s done! I’ve fitted up a dummy AC evaporator box and this makes the whole wiring layout easy to see for loom wrapping. Might have to try and wrap in-situ to get a better shape into the wiring loom rather than wrapping on the floor/bench and it not move or mould in the way I want it to.

Cheers

Bennie

[Barbbachello]

VSS and neutral switch will absolutely cause a CEL