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Joel's BRZ

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#301 JDWhiteWRX

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Posted 26 June 2020 - 06:37 PM

Well after 14 variations of my design I feel I have come up with a scale model that is at least 95% complete.
 
In order to complete it 100% I would need to know the final corner weights.
 
I wanted to write down something about how I got to this point, a few weeks ago I knew almost nothing about pushrod suspension other than there would be advantages to having it in this project.
 
So if I had some CAD software and knew how to use it I could have saved myself some time but I don't and there is something special about building a scale mock up, holding it in yours hands and seeing something work in real life, not on a screen.
 
I knew that I needed to know how much the shock would move relative to the wheels, this is the motion ratio. It does not stay constant throughout the movement of the wheel.
 
The next consideration is packaging. I knew I could put the shock almost anywhere it would fit but I wanted to keep it as low as possible to benefit the COG. The obvious choice was almost directly inline with the motion of the lower control arm, the only things in the way are the main chassis frame rail and the steering linkage between the steering rack and steering column.
 
Early mock up was done with some cardboard and a pressure can.
 
xcBHrI7.jpg?1
 
I knew there was a possibility to use motorcycle shocks but had no idea if it could really work on a full size car until I had figured out the motion ratios. I used the dimensions of a Suzuki Hyabusa shock found online as it was the largest size with a decent amount of springrate options.
 
Next I made the 3 points everything would pivot around out of some steel and minimally tack welded them into position on the car.
 
This is the pushrod attachment on the lower wishbone. The hole position is based on getting a 5/8" rod end as close to the outer pivot as possible.
 
otzBqgp.jpg?1
 
The bellcrank pivot is shown here, I ended up moving this a couple of times.
 
M9gcScU.jpg?1
 
All the other parts are made of some scrap aluminium extrusions I had lying around the garage. This photo shows all the bits used so far.
 
9wwsBev.jpg?1
 
To mimic the shock travel I made the eye to eye length match the Hyabusa shock with a ruler stuck inside the extrusion to read zero millimetres.
 
The whole point of using this pushrod setup is to have the springrate increase at the wheel (wheel rate) as the aero pushes down on the car at increasing speed. To do this you need a rising rate suspension.
The parameters you can play with to achieve this are all in the bellcrank design.
 
You have the distance to where the pushrod mounts to the bellcrank from the pivot point and the distance to where the shock mounts to the bellcrank from the pivot point. 
 
Then you have the angle between the pushrod attachment point on the bellcrank and bellcrank pivot and the angles between the shock attachment point on the bellcrank and bellcrank pivot.
 
A good starting point is 90 degrees for both these angles. For progressive you set the shock angle at 90 at full bump travel and the pushrod angle to 90 at full droop.
 
Why 90 degrees? 
 
As the wheels come up in bump the shock approaches 90* which is the angle at which it is pushing back most thus increasing the rate at the wheels. If it were to go past 90* then it would become easier again so this is why we set it to 90* at full bump travel.
 
On the pushrod side the angle is getting smaller as the wheel comes up so by setting it at 90 at full droop all the advantage is with the shock as it approaches 90.
 
These 90* settings give you a very progressive rate but its a good starting point and then you can adjust to lower the rate from there.
 
The way I got the starting 90* angles was two use to separate bits of extrusion with holes drilled in them instead of a solid bellcrank, see photo below.
 
en1i9zX.jpg
 
So I just set my angles in bump and droop and scribed a line in the middle so I could make a solid bellcrank. It took a few tries as the shock would hit the chassis rail at full droop or was too close to the steering linkage.
 
You can see in this photo I had some cardboard to show where the spring would sit and possibly hit things.
 
f0UCr1A.jpg?1
 
Once I had a solid bellcrank made I could then move the wheel in 10mm increments and measure the position on the shock mock up. The first few didn't work as I was not getting full shock travel or too much travel or the shock was hitting the chassis rail etc. I had to keep drilling new holes and making longer pushrods.
 
Once I had something that gave me full shock travel for the complete wheel travel I made a spreadsheet in excel and plotted a graph.
 
Motion ratio = wheel travel / shock travel
 
not to be confused with installation ratio which I have seen interchanged with motion ratio and this added a lot of confusion
 
If the motion ratio is decreasing with wheel travel then you have a progressive suspension rate.
 
How much progression do you need?
 
Well I still don't know, the last 2 books I bought didn't really have as much detail on progressive suspension rates as I would have liked. I have read that 10% is enough but that was a road car, the Carroll Smith book I have is too old but he does mention no more than 20% increasing slope if you graph the wheel rate.
 
The spring ratio is constant, its the wheel rate you want to know.
 
The wheel rate is just the spring rate / motion ratio ^2
 
My most recent version of bellcrank gives an 11.6% increasing wheel rate slope if you graph it but what I have done is measure the motion ratios of pushrod to bellcrank attachment points in 4 positions around a central point so I would know the exact effect of moving this attachment point in any direction. So once I know my final corner weights I can make a bellcrank exactly how I need it. I can also put multiple attachment points on the bellcrank if I require stiffer or softer wheel rates after testing.
 
I didn't end up using a Hyabusa shock in the end, they are only 2 way adjustable, not 3 way like the GSXR1000 shocks I bought and after working out the math I knew almost any shock could work. It's crazy how cheap they are to buy too!

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#302 El_Freddo

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Posted 28 June 2020 - 09:10 AM

So much awesome in this build Joel! The amount of effort and learning is insane! I don’t quite understand everything but you’ve got me understanding it more than I did half an hour ago!

I guess the rear end will be the next victim for the same treatment?

Cheers

Bennie
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#303 JDWhiteWRX

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Posted 28 June 2020 - 10:41 AM

So much awesome in this build Joel! The amount of effort and learning is insane! I don’t quite understand everything but you’ve got me understanding it more than I did half an hour ago!

I guess the rear end will be the next victim for the same treatment?

Cheers

Bennie

 

 

Thanks Bennie,

 

Rising rate suspension in the rear would be very tricky to design and make the car behave on track although I could still build a pushrod suspension with a linear wheel rate. The other nice thing with the pushrod setup is that its so cheap since the motorcylcle shocks are so readily available, I only paid $100 for the one I have already, compare that to the price of a good set of coilovers!

 

I'm still undecided about the rear end either way, I could do another pushrod but linear rate or I could just use some standard rear coilovers.


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#304 allpaw4

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Posted 26 August 2020 - 10:28 AM

Holy crap, just spent the best part of 4 hours re-reading this thread. Well done, its certainly progressing well. Keen to see where this goes. Kudos to you man!

Cheers,
Ben

MY00 Red RX, a nice daily that was sold off once the B4 became reliable...
MY02 Blue B4, aka 'The Project' - v8 JDM STi engine package and assorted other 'goodies' - Sold, then bought back for parts. Stripped and crushed.
MY03 Blue RX, the newer old daily, pretty well more B4 than RX now... In the process of being converted to the track toy... Watch this space!
MY02 Silver Wagon, H6 conversion, full blue/black leather and almost full black interior to go with it.
MY03 White/Silver H6 Outback, donor car for silver waghoon.
MY97 Silver RX, acquired to become track car, but plans changed. To be stripped and scrapped in time.


#305 JDWhiteWRX

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Posted 19 October 2020 - 06:30 PM

It has been a long time since I have made any updates to this thread, not a lot has happened with the car but I have been collecting some parts and investing in more fabrication tools.
 
Today I picked up a set of tyres which I will need to have so I can modify the body for the new ride height and make some new panels to suit. These tyres are way past their use by date but I got them dirt cheap. No point buying new tyres unless I was planning to drive this thing some time soon.
 
I couldn't resist the opportunity to mock up what the car might look like with some wheels on, speaking of wheels, they will be my next purchase.
 
lvirmxj.jpg?1
 
mYQnwgg.jpg?1

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#306 El_Freddo

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Posted 19 October 2020 - 08:00 PM

Geez, this thing will look truely phat once done!!

I thought with covid you’d have this done by now! :P

Cheers

Bennie
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#307 allpaw4

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Posted 20 October 2020 - 08:30 AM

Wow. Thats gonna look insane. Credit to you and your workmanship man!

Cheers,
Ben

MY00 Red RX, a nice daily that was sold off once the B4 became reliable...
MY02 Blue B4, aka 'The Project' - v8 JDM STi engine package and assorted other 'goodies' - Sold, then bought back for parts. Stripped and crushed.
MY03 Blue RX, the newer old daily, pretty well more B4 than RX now... In the process of being converted to the track toy... Watch this space!
MY02 Silver Wagon, H6 conversion, full blue/black leather and almost full black interior to go with it.
MY03 White/Silver H6 Outback, donor car for silver waghoon.
MY97 Silver RX, acquired to become track car, but plans changed. To be stripped and scrapped in time.


#308 JDWhiteWRX

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Posted 20 October 2020 - 02:49 PM

Thanks guys,

 

I've had a lot more time recently but not enough money to really push on. I ended up spending the money I had saved for the gearbox on a new TIG welder which will allow me to weld aluminium.

 

Other than that my other expensive hobbies have kept me poor.


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#309 JDWhiteWRX

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Posted 30 November 2020 - 11:15 AM

Hey guys, a few things have been happening.
 
To start with I have taken delivery of my new AC/DC dedicated TIG welder. Up until now I have been doing all my welding using a multi-purpose MIG welder that has a lift-arc TIG function in DC only.
Now that I have a welder that can weld any type of metal I can save a lot of money by making my own catch cans, dry sump tank, swirl pots for example. So it has cost a fair bit up front for the welder but over the long run it should pay for itself.
 
After a fair bit of back and forth with measurements I have also ordered a set of wheels from Japan. The wheels are 18 x 10.5 but I have had to be very careful with the offset because I am in danger of the car being too wide to fit on my trailer. I won't spoil the surprise and say what they are but as soon as they arrive there will be lots of photos. Unfortunately due to Covid they are going to take a fair while to arrive.
 
The last thing is I have ordered a pair of genuine Subaru rear wheel bearings off the 08 onwards STi to convert the rear end to 5x114.3 pcd. The front RX8 uprights are already 5x114.3 so this has given me larger wheel bearings and a much wider selection of wheels to choose from.

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#310 El_Freddo

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Posted 30 November 2020 - 03:34 PM

The wheels are 18 x 10.5 but I have had to be very careful with the offset because I am in danger of the car being too wide to fit on my trailer.

I have taken delivery of my new AC/DC dedicated TIG welder.


I don’t see the problem...

The last thing is I have ordered a pair of genuine Subaru rear wheel bearings off the 08 onwards STi to convert the rear end to 5x114.3 pcd. The front RX8 uprights are already 5x114.3 so this has given me larger wheel bearings and a much wider selection of wheels to choose from.


That seems a little too easy, but a great way to go about it with few mods if any.

Can’t wait for pics!

Cheers

Bennie
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#311 JDWhiteWRX

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Posted 30 November 2020 - 05:10 PM

I don’t see the problem...


That seems a little too easy, but a great way to go about it with few mods if any.

Can’t wait for pics!

Cheers

Bennie

 

My trailer is pretty fancy with a large torque tube running from one side to the other which enables me to drop the whole thing on its belly using hydraulics for loading the car without ramps. There are a couple of tabs I could modify for some extra width but I think its just easier to keep the car within the width of the original design. The offset I went with will also leave me with a better scrub radius, the tradeoff is the turning circle as inner clearance becomes less.

 

Yes the rear STi wheel bearings simply bolt on in place of the original smaller 5x100 versions. I already have a pair of STi brembo rear brake calipers so all I need now is the rotors, I plan to get some 2 piece rear rotors for extra weight savings. 


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#312 El_Freddo

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Posted 04 December 2020 - 11:19 PM

Fair enough on the trailer mods - I’ve seen a few torsion bar trailers but not on a car trailer! Must be good to tow. Does it have sway bars? Only asking as I made the dodgiest looking trailer from a rusted out Ute tub with the rear end from an MY wagon (same as a brumby with torsion rear end). That was over ten years ago now! Great for towing delicate stuff as the torsion rear end seems to float over many bumps. It could probably do with a sway bar to help out a little more in the corners even though it corners well, it might just stop some of the bouncing it does even though it’s got a good set of shocks on it. Small thing...

I digress!

Cheers

Bennie
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#313 JDWhiteWRX

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Posted 08 December 2020 - 02:33 PM

The torque tube is just for lifting and lowering the trailer for loading, it doesn't have any suspension, just uses the car's suspension, its a very clever design.

 

https://www.raceking.com.au/


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#314 allpaw4

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Posted 08 December 2020 - 09:11 PM

How does it tow empty? Minus the suspension, I see it bouncing all over the road, especially at 350kg tare!

Looked at the website, very cheap for a car trailer, will be looking here for mine when I get one.

MY00 Red RX, a nice daily that was sold off once the B4 became reliable...
MY02 Blue B4, aka 'The Project' - v8 JDM STi engine package and assorted other 'goodies' - Sold, then bought back for parts. Stripped and crushed.
MY03 Blue RX, the newer old daily, pretty well more B4 than RX now... In the process of being converted to the track toy... Watch this space!
MY02 Silver Wagon, H6 conversion, full blue/black leather and almost full black interior to go with it.
MY03 White/Silver H6 Outback, donor car for silver waghoon.
MY97 Silver RX, acquired to become track car, but plans changed. To be stripped and scrapped in time.


#315 JDWhiteWRX

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Posted 09 December 2020 - 12:34 PM

How does it tow empty? Minus the suspension, I see it bouncing all over the road, especially at 350kg tare!

Looked at the website, very cheap for a car trailer, will be looking here for mine when I get one.

 

 

Not great but doable, you have to drop the tyres down to about 16psi. I have no reason to tow without a car on it except for when the pink slip is required each year (only in NSW :rolleyes:)


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#316 JDWhiteWRX

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Posted 09 December 2020 - 07:52 PM

Rear wheel bearings arrived today, brand new genuine Subaru from the 08+ STi. Got these to convert the rear to 5x114.3 PCD so when my new wheels arrive I can bolt them straight on.
 
The front PCD is already 5x114.3 with the Mazda RX8 front uprights.
 
bdzalF5.jpg?1
 
Next to the old wheel bearings you can easily see the size difference.
 
cE8eXWg.jpg?1

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#317 El_Freddo

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Posted 09 December 2020 - 11:06 PM

Ripper mate! I wish I could just bolt those bearings onto the back end of my L series to easily get the 5x100 PCD and EJ brakes!

Gotta love how much Subaru models are generally like Lego!

Cheers

Bennie
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#318 JDWhiteWRX

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Posted 27 December 2020 - 08:40 AM

I have been modifying the Honda K24 valve cover so that the motor is less tall and dry sump ready. The design is based on the Honda Racing HPD valve cover.
 
I'll do a more detailed post once the work is done but here is a teaser for now.
 
50760180403_22301afd8c_z.jpg
 
I am also hoping to have a gearbox coming within the next few weeks.

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#319 JDWhiteWRX

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Posted 29 December 2020 - 01:36 PM

Some exciting news, I finally got a trans for the car! It's a ZF 5 speed S5D 320Z from a BMW. Good for 320Nm of torque which should be plenty behind my turbo K24 engine. I weighed the box at around 37kg which is rather light considering the strength, its very compact too.
 
mShV1Z8.jpg?1
 
Now I just need to get an adapter plate and I will be able to get a lot more fabrication done, engine mounts, trans mount, steering rack mounts etc.

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#320 JDWhiteWRX

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Posted 02 January 2021 - 11:48 AM

I did some test welding yesterday on some of the scrap cast aluminium I cut off the valve cover just to see how it welds and how well it might clean up after with a flap disc and file finish.
 
It was not as difficult as expected so as long as I can manage the heat I have a lot more confidence in the project now.
 
50789281181_4f7cafcb33_c.jpg

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